SH 15M WTF?

[alanthiana]

Markus is just as cynical as me...I didn't think I'd ever know someone like that -_-

Unfortunately, I have to agree with Markus. With everything I've seen recently, my feelings about society has gone down a lot. It seems like things are all about "me", and not about anyone else. So many people seem not to care about anyone else. With the amazing amounts of ways people can communicate, communication seems to be dead.

I'm not saying there isn't anything like true love. I'm not saying people can't be faithful. But it isn't expected.

It used to be, if a woman was unfaithful, there was shame and scandel for the entire family. People actually cared. These days, people don't even turn their heads. Cheating, who cares? Not society, because it apparently doesn't matter.

[alanthiana]

1-Why is it that gun possession gets you 6 months in jail but murder gets you 25 with an L? WTF you think guns do!!
Because in this day and age, people feel so unsafe, that they think they need guns. Instead of spending the time and money to actually become licensed to carry, they just ignore laws.

2-Why is it legal to slowly drink yourself to death?
Because no one like to talk about problems. If you try to vent, people just pat you on the shoulder, and go on their way.

3-Why is it legal to slowly smoke yourself to death?
...I won't touch this, as I am a chain smoker =/

4-Why is 2 and 3 legal but smoking a joint is illegal?
Because people abuse pot, and it became out of control, so they needed laws to control it. I wish they would legalize it, and educate people more.

5-Why did they execute a 5 time Nobel Peace Prize nominee Tookie Williams?
...because he murdered people.

6-Why is it, that we have more medication on the market then ever before....but people don't live longer? Why the hell dont they ever find the cure to anything, but yet, we have more and more medication everyday...
(I know its cruel, but I cant wait till the babyboomers pass away and all these rip off pharmaceutical companies close!)
Because all people want to do is ignore issues, and they want a quick fix. Just pop a pill, and you can forget about anything that makes your life less than perfect.

7- Why is it, that people still call EO only a social Linkshell?
Not sure...

8- Why is it that the store I work in makes 10 million a year easy, but they cant pay there managers properly...
Greed. Plain and simple.

9- Why do we live in a society where the entire fucking population has no gawd damn power? We all just sit back while some dumb ass politicians decide everything for us. And all they do is fuck shit up more. And we keep going with this FAKE democracy... We should be able to electronically vote on everything. I guess the reason we cant do that is because a large portion of the population is unfortunately incompetent...
NIMBY. Not in my back yard. As long as things do not have a personal impact on someone, they do not care.

10- Why does Markus rant so much?
Because you care? Because you want things to change? Because it depresses you to see the downfalls?

[Markus]

IDK, I dont think I am cynical. I think that this is just the way things are. It's realistic. Its facts. People dont get married as often as before. Many people just stay single. People dont stay married as long as before. Many marriages end in divorce.

Girls cheat. Girls date married men. Girls -want- to be with guys with girfriends. I know this doesnt apply to every girl, but it applies to a lot of them. This didnt exist 20-30 years ago. How do I know this? Because I am 26 years old. The majority of the cashiers/cosmetians/lab technicians at work are 16-25. Mostly students. A few of them have unwavering morals. The majority... Lets say they rather party and have fun more then anything else.

I blame the media. Men finally got what they wanted. But it backfired. Cause now men have all the exact same social pressures that girls have had for a few decades. Men are expected to have a certain physical appearance, the magazines say so. Men are expected to have a certain social and financial stature. Movies and TV say so. What is good for the goose is good for the gander...

Jesus, whatever happened to 'Its the inside that counts'... Its the inside that counts all right! The inside of your walltet!! You better have some fancy smancy colored plastic in there! And lots of paper... Or how about the inside of your titties... Fill em with silicone... I know 19 year old girls who have had implants. There parents paid for them. WTF is that? Society is screwed its all upside down.

....

Shit is all fucked up! I could go on forever ranting about this stuff lol....

So ya.... end rant lol.

[tempus]

alanthiana said:

Markus is just as cynical as me...I didn't think I'd ever know someone like that -_-

I do hope you werent serious when you said you didnt think others arent as cynical.

Most of the cynics.... the hard core 'Who cares?' types, actually care a lot. It's just that at some point they've been hurt, and hurt bad. So bad, they won't let themselves even hope anymore for fear of being disappointed and hurt again.

The rest of you cynics can say you disagree with this, and I'll just go on thinking you're lying to yourself. >=)

Animals can be driven crazy by placing too many in too small a pen. Homo sapiens is the only animal that voluntarily does this to himself.

/em goes back to the gallery to hang with Beren.

-t

[Markus]

Seeing as how I like to critisize society so openly. Perhaps I should take a closer look at my relationship with my girl friend. We are about to ding 3 years.

True Love? Yes. I truly do love her. She is the greatest thing since the George Foreman grill. Does she truly love me? She says she does. I believe her... usually. Some days when shit is all fucked up, I have doubts. I ask myself questions like, why the hell would anyone love me? Mark is as fucked up as a guest on Jerry Springer or worse... a guest on Dr. Phil.

What I fear? Like most people. I don't want to be alone. All I need is her. No one else. She makes the moon shine and the sun rise. She is the triple A battery in my wireless remote...

I also fear that I may turn this relationship into the same relationship my parents had. History tends to repeat itself. I have never hit a woman. I don't drink or smoke cigarettes, but I've done my share of drugs. I am verbally abusive, like both of my parents. No I dont call her names. But I yell. That's just the way we communicate at home. We yell. The person who yelled the loudest was the only one who was heard. I try to explain to her that its just the way thigs are where I come from and that I will try and change. But old habits die hard. Her family isnt much of yellers lol...

I am impatient. Sometimes we are doing something and I react -exactly- the way my father would. I feel like stabbing myself each time I make those realizations. I quickly try and be nice and right my wrong. That doesnt work though because its too sudden. Its too moody. She doesnt get the reason why behind it, she doesnt know my parents... So its like I am just trying to suck up after being a dick. Wich is kind of true, but its more like I am just trying to change... How else am I gonna break the cycle?



Will this love beat the odds and last forever? I guess I should start by asking her to marry me. But neither of us is ready for that. She is younger then me and about to finish university. I guess time will tell. I certainly hope so because I havent met a person that would be able to make me happier.

Lol I should try and be like her. She works with troubled teens. I mean suicidal girls, drug addicts, the whole nine and none of them are over 17...Wtf am I doing to make an impact on the world? Shit all. Another day, another dollar...

/end rant i guess. I am supposed to be working... So thoughts may be a lil unorganized lol

[Markus]

Lol sorry for being an open book. I know it turns some people off and scares other people away...

[estara]

markus said:

11- WHY?!

read The People's History of the United States, if you haven't already. It will answer most of your questions, and unlike other history books, its an engaging and quick read (well, each chapter is quick I think).


As for your relationship, I would say try couple's counseling. No, it's not just for couples on the rocks. It provides a safe environment for you guys to talk about your differences and come to terms with them. And if you really want to spend your life with her, it would be best to talk about that before it becomes a problem.

Women have a way of not talking about their problems that can drive men nuts and ruin relationships. Those women who cheat on their significant other because they don't feel like they get enough love... do you think they tryed very hard to inform their men of it? Not usually. Women bottle it up inside because we aren't supposed to tell men about our problems. Women exist to sooth and comfort men, not burden them with their emotional hell (sarcastic voice). That's how it feels anyway.

[chaucer]

being an open book shows that u are human and that u are not a machine.

the funny thing about realism is that your reality can change if u want it to. i feel that we all can view life and say there are liers, thieves, killers, etc. but that doesn't mean we all have to accept the idea that most everyone is one of the above. ppl have moments of weakness in their lives and the ones i love i forgive in their moment of weakness. we all have them. read "A Separate Peace" to understand more about this.

Despair is one sign of a moment of weakness...ppl tend to act out of charator in their moment of despair. does that mean if they hurt me i should turn my back. i'm not sure that is the answer. markus your g/f helps troubled teens....young ppl who find themselves deep into a moment of weakness. if she turned her back where would most of these ppl be...yes it's true she can't save them all...but isn't it worth it if she can help 1 in her life?

as for true love...it's out there...yes ppl settle for who they think is their true love but they only see the picture that's painted in the sand. your true love will not always love u...but they are still your true love. we can't make ppl see that and if we turn our backs on them, we turn our backs on ourselvses.

When i was a teenageer i was an angry man...then i found peace in college...then i was angry at the world again...and now i've seen peace again. history would show that i'm about to be an angry man again but i found one thing that stops that cycle...i found that i understand i have a cycle and i dont want someone to love me for the moment but to love that i am a cycle of passion and peace. that is part of my soul and that will never change. if we all viewed our love with that type of understanding i think we would find what one would call true love.

[isabo]

Why I got upset:

I recently joined AKO (Army Knowledge Online) chat so that I can chat live with Aidar when he is on the computers. They had a "Married friends only" chat room so I figured I would check it out. Well, that was my first mistake. Friends only my ass. I got 10 PM's the second I said, "hello room" ranging from "A/S/L" to "Do you wanna f**k" There were a few married people in the room and we got to chatting, after I closed all the PM windows and said in room that if anyone else PMed me I was going to report them. One man in the room asked, "How does it make you feel that your husband is paying five bucks to sleep with hookers where he is right now?" This was followed by numerous other men saying, "Yeah, the chicks were sweet when we were deployed." and "Dude, EVERYONE got some while we were gone." etc. The general consensus in the room was that all deployed soldiers cheat and that Aidar was going to cheat on me if he hadn't already so I should just get used to it. So, seeing you say that those of us who have found true love should "enjoy it while it lasts" just brought up that nasty memory. I don't appreciate people implying that my marriage is doomed to failure. I'm not saying that you were talking about me necessarily but I still took offense because it seemed like a blanket statement. Am I too sensitive? Probably. Aidar tells me I am all the time. Am I insecure in my relationship now that he is gone? Maybe but I'd like to think not. I love him and trust him and have every confidence that he will not cheat on me. Do these statements contradict each other? Absolutely.

"Women are liberated but men are still expected to play the traditional role" I disagree. Do you know how many families I know where the woman is employed and the man is not, or if they are both employed, the woman makes more money and supports the family? And the women in these relationships still take on most, if not all, of the household duties. I do not expect my husband to support me. Coming from NY, if you didn't have a high paying job you couldn't even dream of getting out of your parents house. My rent was $1750 a month for a tiny one bedroom in Brooklyn. I wasn't out looking for a rich man to save me from my life. I made something of myself, got multiple degrees and guaranteed that I will always be able to support myself, and my spouse if need be. Am I a hypocrite because I am not working right now and I am living off of Aidar's paycheck? No, because I helped him get out of debt and my paychecks for the past two years are sitting in a savings account to buy us a home when we get back to the states. If he needed some time to get his priorities straight and not work then I would fully support that. In fact, when he was flirting with the idea of going to school to be an officer I didn't even hesitate. That would have meant living on my salary and using my benefits and paying to get him through school.

Women are not the only ones who are turned on by someone who is attached. Do you know how many men try to pick me up around here? And I wear my ring and talk about my husband all the time. Not to mention the freaks in that chat room, some of whom are married. It's not evil women who want to steal other women's husbands away. It's just people in general, insecure people who need to make themselves feel better my making other people miserable. People who don't think they have enough out of like and always need something more. People who constantly need attention from members of the opposite sex. PEOPLE, not just women.

As to your most recent post, I had some bad things happen to me in my youth and they have seeped into my marriage so I know how you feel. If you are going to break the cycle it needs to be in every aspect of your life, not just with your girlfriend, but with your family as well.

I'm not saying you do this, but it drives me crazy when people use their past to excuse their present behavior. "Well I was abused so I'm doomed to be an abuser." Stop being a victim and take ownership of your own behavior (again, talking about people in general, not you Markus). I am guilty of it too and it kills me but I have done everything in my power to be more conscious of it and try to stop it from happening.

I seem to be losing steam and I have totally lost my train of thought. I hope I have cleared up why your post upset me and again, I'm not mad at you. I have always had a great deal of respect for you. I appreciate your openness.

[-=[Tork]=-]

women = god's cruel joke on man kind.... but even I can find a laugh in that joke. I actually caught myself up on all this but as earlier in the week I was in the mood to discuss all of this... not I could careless i just feel like walking around smiling and having a good time. I was watching that new show called the Colbert report and they had on this female author who wrote a book “Are men needed” or something like that I can’t recall the exact title…. But she got on to saying the answer is “of course” and how feminism has changed from women’s liberation to a women finding her inner slut and turning themselves in to sex objects. That was about the jist of it. I kind of found that interesting though and to some degree true…. Women go about trying to find guys in a better and often time more aggressive fashion then men do. I guess I’m done for awhile I’m sure the next time I check this thread(tomorrow) it will be 10 pages longer and 30 more mins of reading…. Just remember in the end……

I am the walrus.

Peace…


Ah fucking hell this too: I’m all for self-accountability, I don’t cut anyone slack in that department no matter what it is, whether it be addictions or blaming actions on their past…. Guess what I’ve had a fucked up past but I’ve turned my life around…. Now the addiction thing I do talk about a lot with friends I have and they can get kind of angry at me because I simply believe it does not exist… it is just people of some sort liking something of the sort and doing to much of it period. I truly hold onto the ideal tht to live life and be a strong person is the best you can hope for and if you are going to let yourself be ruled by an addiction you are weak. I want to tell you something also about that belief my mom’s dad died when she was 6 of cancer related to smoking and my grand ma and grand p on my dad’s side died within the last year of smoking/drinking related diseases because of their life long addictions. I’ve done some pretty fucked up shit and in comparison way more “CHEMICALY” addicting then cigarettes and alcohol…. I’ve found that the majority of fuckers who do drugs just want the self pitty or they are once again masochist and like watching their entire world fall apart… for me I think that is a big reason…. It is an odd feeling you get when you do drugs your life falls apart before your eyes but you have strange feeling of satisfaction and happiness( not really happiness it is kind of hard to explain, i could write more or tell you about it if any of you want lol)…. I know it is fucked up. Really fucked up.

I got myself turned around though and am living a good life at the moment and I couldn’t be more happy but I’ve gone through things a lot worse then those people and I didn’t completely give myself over to an addiction and then blame it on tobacco companies and all that other shit. I think it is a major cop-out to do so… I also hate frivolous law suits like fat ass people suing McDonalds for making them fat. I’ve tried to keep clean and I’ve been doing a good job at it. I still have a few little habits but they aren’t too hard to get rid of…. I chew for one, which are I think something like 32x more nicotine in one did then one cigarette. The only reason I do chew is because it is very nostalgic of smoking weed and that kind of high… the buzz that is and I usually just drop it after I loose the buzz… No one in America or any other developed country has the right to say they can’t make it, turn themselves around or make things better for themselves… I used to go beg for money down at the old market 1-2 years ago and you know what its actually not bad money. I’m not kidding I can make more then minimum wage an hour begging for money then working… bums are just lazy I know people who live on the streets, just not willing to do anything, fuck man I’ve had thoughts of moving to the west coast and being a bum in some place like San Francisco.

Heh…. I didn’t expect me to go on for this long… any who life in my opinion can take you anywhere you want it… you just work hard and don’t work against the flow of things and every thing will come out perfectly for you. I could continue but I’ve written enough for tonight.

[-=[Tork]=-]

you know what, fuck it i'm gonna get stoned and order ROBOTS ondemand.

[chaucer]

isabo said:

Why I got upset:

I recently joined AKO (Army Knowledge Online) chat so that I can chat live with Aidar when he is on the computers....

Isabo, I totally agree with everything u said. especially about women that work for the family and not the men and when ppl use their past as and excuse for their presant behavior.

my life was tough...still is at times...but i'm tired of ppl using their past hardships has a reason for their insecurities today. i've said this in the past and yes ppl have moments of weakness and act out of charator. example, Jeff Readon (one of the best closers in MLB) lost his son a year ago. times have been tough on him and he just got off anti-depresants. he went into a jewlery store in the mall and unarmed and tried to rob it. i'm not one that goes for that temporary insane bullshit bc too many ppl try to use it but insome cases, they have a tempory moment of weakness...does that make them exempt from a crime, NO it doesn't. ofcourse it depends on each situation but all in all everyone has moments of weakness...some heavier then others and some longer then others. it's up the individual to get out of their weakness and stop being a victom so they can continue being the best person they can for ppl they love and that love them.

As far as the army thing goes...i no nothing about it but i do know ppl in it and maybe it's because i only surround myself with the very best ppl, but i didn't get the impression that most cheat. I dont really KNOW u or aidar but from what i observe u both are ppl of the finest stock. does that mean everything will be perfect in your lives? ofourse not. but as the best ppl goes, u both have the knowledge and expericence to deal with the situations better then others. that's just my opinion

One of the last things i want to say today is to reinforce my idea about the soul. if u asked anyone what that means i don't think most ppl really know or misinterpret it to be the heart or mind.

to me, everyone has experiences...u will have things happen to u or see things that happen around u. the defining moment in a person's life isn't the experience....it's how they decide if those exp's where right or wrong. it shapes their charactor into who they are today and who they will be in the future. what drives their decision of right or wrong i feel is the soul. the soul is an innate, immutable, forever presence that takes experience and builds a charactor.

enough babbleing...see u in game.

[_Code]

Dont Do Eeet!!!!! Robots Sucked!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[_Code]

I'm at work today, just caught up on this thread... and I'm out til subject changes. Tho I agree with the finality of everything.

Unfortunately, love is a chemical reaction. Any drug user or ex drug user or anyone perscribed anything ever will tell you that any chemical reaction will wear with time, or the subject becomes used to its effects.

However, here's the clincher. Friends dont have to change so long as both grow together. Thats where the relationship works or doesn't, and thats where the members flexibility comes into play. Isa, if you and Aidar are friends, and grow together, then your fine. Markus gave a blanket statement (which I agree with), that basically leads a simple formula.

Meet Boy/Girl
Fall In love
Get all you can out of it.
Move on or if it lasts your whole lives die together happily ever after.

Whether the relationship lasts, its the same logic for every relationship. Successful or not. My exes in the past I still feel (mostly) were very successful relationships. We were together, there were good times, and we both learned alot in the relationship. The fact that we're still not together doesn't make it a failure in any way. But just so long as both members grow together, your fine.

I had a friend through school. We knew each other, literally, our whole lives. After high school we were still friends for a long time. We had a falling out eventually (long story), and didn't talk for about a year. When we did talk again, we settled all business, but we had grown apart. And it wasn't just the year off, it had begun directly after high school. Its just the way things are. Everyone wants individuality, and originality in themselves and other people, but then dont understand why they can't get along with someone, continually for 50 years.

My ex fiance is a blood sucking demon cunt. I Loved her very much, I promise you she wasnt like that when I met her and fell in love with her (tho I was on alot of drugs, maybe I should get Nauren to confirm that? >.>). We just didn't grow together, thats all.

Another point, and kinda sorta not really in the frame of long term relationships, but more of the idea of being in love:

Being in love is a situational. That is a timed experience.

When I was 15-16 I fell in love. Not some teenage, "oh i'm in love" thing. Deep love, and it still hurts. I'm sure everyone here can relate to something like that. I've been lucky enough to be in love several times. And I still love each one of them; But i'm in love with ghosts. The girl I loved died, as did the boy who loved her. She was in chrysalis to become the young women they became, and I to become who I am today, and that was the end.

But it doesn't change how I felt, or how I still feel. You dont just fall in love with a person, you fall in love with a time and a place.

"All at once, we were madly, clumsily, shamelessly, agonizingly in love."

"the poison was in the wound, you see. And the wound wouldn't heal"

-Vladimir Nabokov "Lolita"

Isabo; from hearing the way you talk about Aidar, and seeing you two interact, you keep falling in love, again and again. You too are in love with a time. And it happens every day for you. I envy you. I however, and it sounds like Markus as well, are too gaurded, and wont allow that. I'm happy where I am. But I dont expect it to last forever.

[estara]

codeine said:

Unfortunately, love is a chemical reaction.

I could disagree with you about that..... >,>

But I'm too tired to talk about it.


Bad idea not going to bed until 3am....


Tork... don't do it and btw rename this thread so people don't think we're talking about the SH for 11 pages... name it something like, Everything and Nothing or A Wandering Discussion on Love, Life, Betrayal and Inner Peace.... ya... like the second one....

so tired.....