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Post by Breht on Mar 11, 2009 16:41:01 GMT -5
I've been getting an itch lately to try out WoW. Just contemplating the idea at the moment... few questions.
1. How long is EO planning on staying active on WoW?
2. How long would it take me to learn the game and level up to be involved in EO events?
3. How much playtime does WoW take? I guess compared to FFXI.
Those are my main questions for now and I shall continue contemplating the idea... lol. All feedback is truly appreciated.
Breht
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Post by Sosa on Mar 11, 2009 17:29:21 GMT -5
1. I'm not sure. We're starting a new progression line and this expansion will probably have some life breathed into it at some point as they continue to release raid content. Some people are starting to tire out, but I think the core group that raids is probably in it for awhile longer. 2. Depending on the class you pick and amount of time you invest, 1-3 months from level 1 to endgame raiding. The grind to 80 itself doesn't take a long time with applied effort. Once you actually hit 80, you have a number of things you need to do before you can start raiding, however. For some specs, it's worse than others. 3. That depends on what you want to do. If you want to play it casually, WoW allows you to do so with a few hours a week. If you want to get into hardcore raiding, you're looking at 20+ hours a week. In terms of farming and item hunting, ect., WoW primarily improves your equipment with active content like PVP or raiding. Money is extremely easy to make, but you'll need it in fairly large chunks at 80. You can expect to spend some time farming at 80, but it's nowhere near the level of farming present in FFXI. Nice to see you again, Breht (this is Sosa.  ) |
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Kaifu1
Soldier
Playing Dragoon is like playing FFXI on Hard Modeplg%%Old School%%[Xb0:Aifuu]
Posts: 1,102
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Post by Kaifu1 on Mar 11, 2009 18:24:17 GMT -5
1. I've come and gone from WoW a bit, and they are still burning strong. I don't forsee them stopping anytime soon. Unless WoW ends or a better MMO comes out.
2. IMO, WoW does a decent job introducing you (the player) to your class in the beginning.
3. No where the same as FFXI IMO. I can log in for 1 hour or so, and get some daily quests done. Every little bit can help.
Kai~
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Post by Vindication on Mar 12, 2009 12:47:06 GMT -5
I've been getting an itch lately to try out WoW. Just contemplating the idea at the moment... few questions. 1. How long is EO planning on staying active on WoW? 2. How long would it take me to learn the game and level up to be involved in EO events? 3. How much playtime does WoW take? I guess compared to FFXI. Those are my main questions for now and I shall continue contemplating the idea... lol. All feedback is truly appreciated. Breht If you want to level quickly I seriously suggest taking advantage of the refer a friend program. Try to find someone in the guild that has the same playtime and wants to level an alt. While your accounts are linked you gain 300% xp from mobs and questing till 60. However the bonus only works when you are together. Assuming you do the refer a friend bonus, you can level to 80 within 2 weeks of semi-hardcore playing. 2-3 days to get to 60, 2-3 days 60-70, and the rest of the time to get to 80. You can get to 60 within a week playing casually, 60-70 in about 4-5 days playing casually, and 70-80 may take up to two weeks+ playing casually. As long as you are playing with someone familiar with the class you choose they should be able to teach you most of the basics. Comparitively WoW is a lot easier than FFXI, it's also a lot more fast paced (which can make it harder for some people). Compared to FFXI you can get a lot more done in a day playing WoW than FFXI. The new xpac is a little light on material, but for someone new to WoW it is probably perfect. Once you hit 80 it is fairly easy to get geared enough to run Naxx 10 man, and depending on your class you may be able to just go right in. |
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Post by Sosa on Mar 12, 2009 13:59:30 GMT -5
It's not my intention to rip into your post, Mookies... but it'd be better to set some realistic expectations here...
Our definitions of casual seem to be very different. Most players that are working their way through the levels normally without going for a speed record are going to clock 4-5 days of in-game time before they hit level 80. That's 96-120 hours of actual time spent on that character. Assuming you play 5 hours a day, every day, that's still going to take between 19 and 24 days or... almost 3-4 weeks. Even so, it's hard to consider playing five hours a day, every day, "casual."
The players you see running around saying things like "I leveled from 1-70 in 30 hours of played time!" are doing it multiboxing two of their own accounts with the friend bonus or AoE grinding with high level characters to powerlevel themselves. They minimize or eliminate downtime, know exactly where to go and how to get there the fastest, never use the auction house or vendor things, never farm or level professions, only level with a rested bar, ect. A new, or even a normal player is going to take much longer.
Granted, with a 300% exp bonus you can knock a huge chunk of the time from 1-60 off, but it only applies when actually leveling with that friend. Playing without them does not grant the bonus and the bonus no longer applies if their levels drift apart too much. And, to be frank, levels 1-60 contribute half or slightly less of the total time it will take most players to reach 80.
You're right in a several ways, though. One of the things I do like about WoW is that it is accessible to casual players. If you only have an hour or two to play, you can log on and make measurable progress. That's something that was impossible in FFXI... you didn't play that game unless you had several consecutive hours to dedicate to it. Simply leveling the class will probably teach him most of the basics, though I'd have to say steamrolling through the leveling process is counterproductive towards that end.
Lastly, actually gearing and preparing for 10 man raids is significantly easier than it was in BC, can still takes a considerable amount of time if you do it "correctly," and some classes take longer than others. To be frank, a fresh level 80 in green gear should not be raiding regardless of their class. I'm an atypical case because I'm obsessive, but I ran every heroic possible to get the best badge and heroic drop gear possible for my character and paid several thousand gold to get the relevant tanking epics crafted. Several thousand more for gems and enchants. It took me the better part of two weeks playing in a very hardcore fashion, running upwards of 5-8 instances a day and farming in between. Now, I'm not trying to say that normal players will need to subject themselves to that to get into raiding, but I do view some level of that committment as a necessity for anyone who's, say, planning to main tank in a raid. Most DPS can get their rep reward/quest blues and maybe a few epics or enchants and they'll be good. Tanks and healers are going to have a higher bar of entry.
At any rate, the most important thing is that you actually have fun playing. Don't worry about rushing through all the content, it'll still be here when you catch up... and if you find yourself sucked into the game, you'll catch up a lot sooner than you think.
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Milara
Casual Member
Hawt yuri luvvin?
Posts: 25
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Post by Milara on Mar 12, 2009 20:30:40 GMT -5
Playing with someone is a great option. When you need to go it alone though, you can use a leveling guide or add-on to minimize the "I am so lost... where am I supposed to go next?" feeling. ;-) Wow-Pro.com has all the best leveling guide... once you get up to 20, Jame's is the best. They have a leveling guide add-on too that'll help point you to where you need to go. :-) |
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Post by McClebby on Mar 12, 2009 20:55:54 GMT -5
1. How long is EO planning on staying active on WoW?
Not stopping anytime soon.
2. How long would it take me to learn the game and level up to be involved in EO events?
Learning the game is quite fast though if you using the FFXI mentality it gonna be quite..funny at times(WTF why no self heal to keep hate!!)
The leveling up process is less tedious compared to FFXI seem most thing can be soloed anyway. And playing with a friend is good make lvling less boring(Been trying to get Dag to join too) i would say at most you will take 3-4months to get to 80.
The content itself is rather easy now once you know the mechanic behind it and i think most Naxx10 group now are able to piggyback fresh 80.
3. How much playtime does WoW take? I guess compared to FFXI.
The leveling process is less like FFXI. Do not need to worry about going into a pty which break in 30min after you enter since WoW itself the lvling period do not require much or any interaction with other player(lolicecrown5man i solo them >.>) so you can just login for like 2hrs a day and still can move relatively fast compared to FFXI due to rested XP
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Post by Vindication on Mar 13, 2009 0:57:48 GMT -5
It's not my intention to rip into your post, Mookies... but it'd be better to set some realistic expectations here... Our definitions of casual seem to be very different. Most players that are working their way through the levels normally without going for a speed record are going to clock 4-5 days of in-game time before they hit level 80. That's 96-120 hours of actual time spent on that character. Assuming you play 5 hours a day, every day, that's still going to take between 19 and 24 days or... almost 3-4 weeks. Even so, it's hard to consider playing five hours a day, every day, "casual." The players you see running around saying things like "I leveled from 1-70 in 30 hours of played time!" are doing it multiboxing two of their own accounts with the friend bonus or AoE grinding with high level characters to powerlevel themselves. They minimize or eliminate downtime, know exactly where to go and how to get there the fastest, never use the auction house or vendor things, never farm or level professions, only level with a rested bar, ect. A new, or even a normal player is going to take much longer. Granted, with a 300% exp bonus you can knock a huge chunk of the time from 1-60 off, but it only applies when actually leveling with that friend. Playing without them does not grant the bonus and the bonus no longer applies if their levels drift apart too much. And, to be frank, levels 1-60 contribute half or slightly less of the total time it will take most players to reach 80. You're right in a several ways, though. One of the things I do like about WoW is that it is accessible to casual players. If you only have an hour or two to play, you can log on and make measurable progress. That's something that was impossible in FFXI... you didn't play that game unless you had several consecutive hours to dedicate to it. Simply leveling the class will probably teach him most of the basics, though I'd have to say steamrolling through the leveling process is counterproductive towards that end. Lastly, actually gearing and preparing for 10 man raids is significantly easier than it was in BC, can still takes a considerable amount of time if you do it "correctly," and some classes take longer than others. To be frank, a fresh level 80 in green gear should not be raiding regardless of their class. I'm an atypical case because I'm obsessive, but I ran every heroic possible to get the best badge and heroic drop gear possible for my character and paid several thousand gold to get the relevant tanking epics crafted. Several thousand more for gems and enchants. It took me the better part of two weeks playing in a very hardcore fashion, running upwards of 5-8 instances a day and farming in between. Now, I'm not trying to say that normal players will need to subject themselves to that to get into raiding, but I do view some level of that committment as a necessity for anyone who's, say, planning to main tank in a raid. Most DPS can get their rep reward/quest blues and maybe a few epics or enchants and they'll be good. Tanks and healers are going to have a higher bar of entry. At any rate, the most important thing is that you actually have fun playing. Don't worry about rushing through all the content, it'll still be here when you catch up... and if you find yourself sucked into the game, you'll catch up a lot sooner than you think. My rl friend who never played before went 1-60 in under a week with minimal help from me. We made another char and went 1-60 in 2 days with friend bonus. The referred friend has the ability to grant the refer-er a level for every 2 levels he gains. Effectively keeping the level range close if not exactly the same till 60. In all honesty if you can follow questhelper you can finish outlands in 3 days of harcore playing and within a week of normal playing which is what I said above... this is just straight leveling. Northrend is a different story, and by far the longest part but it can realistically be done in two-three weeks of casual play. This is assuming all you do is Quest... of course if you instance/work on tradeskills it is going to take longer. Also while getting the best in slot pre10 man gear would be nice, it is not neccesary with how stupid easy the game is right now. There are obvious no-no's such as Tank gear and healing gear, but as a dps you have a ton of leeway. And the sad fact is that if you know how to play (hit buttons in certain order) you'll out dps the better geared less attentive players. As long as you are within reach of the needed stats to raid 10man content there should be no issues (excluding maly or 2-3drakes of course). |
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Post by Sosa on Mar 13, 2009 13:14:36 GMT -5
For the most part, we're paraphrasing each-other. I'm using required in-game time as a gauge for how quickly people will level, whereas you're using real-life time. The reason I'm using in-game time is because it can be easily converted into real-life time at the rate at which an individual can actually afford to play the game.
This is a problem of perspective. Some new players will want to come into the game, hit 80 as quickly as possible, and start raiding. Others will want to actually experience the game along the way, and will take time out to explore or have fun in other ways. What I am attempting to do is provide a realistic baseline using in-game time, so that it can be matched to the individual player.
Taken from WoW Wiki:
Total EXP required to level from 1-60: 3,872,400
Total EXP required to level from 61-70: 6,268,300
Total EXP required to level from 71-80: 15,965,800
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Total EXP required to level from 1-80: 26,106,500
From this, we can see that the grind from 1-60 comprises only 14.8% of the total amount of exp from 1-80. Outland comprises 24%, while Northrend consumes the lion's share with 61.2%. In reality, however, your EXP gains increase on a non-linear curve as your level does which means that the amount of time you'll spend in each bracket is actually a bit longer in the 1-60 phase, a little less in Outland, and a fair bit less in Northrend than shown. In terms of "leveling time" it's probably more like 25% ~> 20% ~> 55%. That's a great over-generalization, but can be used for our purposes.
Earlier I estimated it would take most players about 96-120 hours to go from 1-80, assuming that they take the time to instance, return to town somewhat frequently, use the auction house, occasionally dabble in PVP or level trade skill, ect. If we can approximate the 1-60 grind as taking 25% of this time, we can assume it will take roughly 24-30 hours. At 5 hours a day, it would take ~5-6 days to finish this grind, or just under a week. This is in line with your friend's accomplishment. 2-3 days of hardcore grinding in Outland also sounds about right and is in line with my own experiences there.
I don't think it's realistic to expect new players to use an add-on like Carbonite Quest or QuestHelper. That's certainly their prerogative, but I know that when I first leveled through content I wanted to actually experience it instead of simply being chaperoned from point A to point B. Do I use them now? Yes, but I've already done the content several times. A lot of players will feel that it's a pointless grind anyway and will simply use them from the get-go, but it's going to be on a case-by-case basis.
To touch on the last part of what you said, in regards to raid preparations: I would like to point out that I qualified that statement several times by saying that mine was an abnormal case and that most players shouldn't need or expect to go through that. I also stated that is was significantly less important for DPS (and this is what I was getting at with the "argument" Dark and I had earlier) than for tanks and healers. So again, I agree with you here.
It is my opinion, however, that strongly raid-oriented players should do everything within their power to avoid other people 'carrying' them through content, and should obtain the best gear, enchants and research, within reason, they can prior to raiding. It is better to encourage exceptionalism than to expect mediocrity.
[Edit: Used the correct EXP value in calculations but put the wrong value for total Northrend EXP (it was equal to the total EXP for levels 1-80. Corrected it.]
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